Methadone Abuse Worse Than Abuse of Other Prescription Opiates
It used to be that methadone was considered the drug of choice when it came to treating opiate addiction. However, with its increasing prevalence as a treatment for chronic pain, methadone has joined the ranks of other commonly abused opioid-based drugs like heroin, Vicodin, OxyContin and others. More than any other prescription painkiller, the rate of overdose by methadone has skyrocketed over the past five years. The rate of increase is about 390 percent according to the National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS).
In 13 percent of overdose fatalities that were reported in the United States, methadone was a contributing or sole cause. Only cocaine kills more people than methadone.
Methadone is far less expensive than other opiate pain relievers like OxyContin, so more and more doctors are prescribing it for that reason. Those who are addicted to opiate pain relievers also resort to methadone pills when they run out of their regular, more expensive prescriptions.
The Drug Enforcement Administration’s Denise Curry says, “It’s out there, it’s available, and it can be dangerous.” Curry says. She also says that methadone is one of the most popular drugs stolen from pharmacies.
Methadone was thought to be safer because its effects are gradual and help those addicted to heroin avoid withdrawal symptoms. However, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) says, “Methadone may build up in the body to a toxic level if it is taken too often, if the amount taken is too high, or if it is taken with certain other medications.”
Methadone stays in the blood stream for up to 59 hours but will only relieve pain for as few as six hours and keep withdrawal symptoms at bay for only 24. It’s easy to feel like you need more methadone long before your body has completely processed the first dose.
Rather than continue the cycle of methadone dosing, pain, withdrawal and possible overdose, it makes more sense to break your addiction to methadone completely. By switching to Suboxone, you can successfully detox off of other opiate drugs and slowly and safely break your opiate addiction completely before it gets the better of you.
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December 29th, 2007 at 4:11 pm
But buprenorphine is addictive too, right? So it’s not like you’d be getting off of opiates if you switch from methadone to buprenorphine, and until the patent expires, isn’t suboxone far more expensive?
January 9th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
Buprenorphine is addictive, too, yes. But its benefit is that it’s a partial agonist where addictive opiates like Vicodin and OxyContin are full agonists. This means that their grip on the opiate receptors isn’t as severe and the addiction is easier to break. It’s a step down, in a sense, from full agonist opiates.
Suboxone is more expensive than methadone but methadone isn’t cheap for those who pay for it out of pocket, either. Most who are on methadone maintenance are not paying for it; it is subsidized by city programs or research studies. Insurance companies don’t pay for methadone maintenance for drug addiction. Ironically, they do cover methadone for pain management. It’s part of the discrimination against the disease of drug addiction, unfortunately.
There are plenty of benefits to methadone but one of them is not efficiency or ease. Methadone requires daily trips to a clinic and Suboxone can be taken at home as a prescription.
Suboxone is also usually used as a detox method as opposed to methadone which is often prescribed as a lifetime sentence. For some, a Suboxone prescription can be done and over after six weeks. There are trade-offs, but for those who are looking for a simpler detox method, Suboxone is highly preferable to methadone.
January 10th, 2008 at 12:53 pm
What? I thought the reason Suboxone “blocks” the effects of other opiates is because it has a higher affinity for opiate receptors than full-agonists. This higher affinity is what keeps the receptors occupied, even if you relapse, so you can’t get high from other opiates while your on suboxone/buprenorphine. The high affinity is also what causes precipitated withdrawals - because the buprenorphine will “knock” any other opiates off whatever receptors they’re occupying, causing that dopesick feeling.
But you seem to be saying that buperenorphine doesn’t have a strong affinity for opiate receptors, therefore is less addictive? That makes no sense at all.
January 13th, 2008 at 3:20 pm
No, buprenorphine doesn’t have a higher affinity for opiate receptors. It has the benefit of sort of “tricking” the brain into thinking that its usual opiate is present but doesn’t have the euphoric effect that makes people feel out of it and unable to do anything except lay around.
Suboxone is a combination of naloxone and buprenorphine and it’s the naloxone that blocks other opiates that you take and blocks even the buprenorphine from binding to the receptors if you dissolve the pill in water and try to shoot it instead of taking it orally as prescribed. A nasty feeling that sends you straight into acute withdrawal.
I hope that helps.
January 14th, 2008 at 6:45 pm
Valeria,
If you google “buprenorphine” and “opiate receptors” and “high affinity” you will get a boatload of links with evidence supporting the fact that buprenorphine does have a higher affinity for opiate receptors than other opiate medication.
Naloxone is NOT active sublingually, so it is not the agent that blocks other opiates from getting you high when you’re on suboxone. That’s why Subutex will have the same effect, even though it is buprenorphine only. When you take Suboxone as you are supposed to, the naloxone doesn’t do diddly squat.
Also, your characterizing addicts as people who “can’t do anything but lay around” is really insulting. Please don’t forget that lots of people become opiate dependent because they were treating pain with prescription medication. Not all of us are laying about in squalor all day. Jeesh.
January 15th, 2008 at 4:31 am
Yes, the naloxone in Suboxone doesn’t take effect unless you try to abuse the drug by dissolving and injecting it. It would be counterproductive otherwise. So yes, the inclusion of naloxone in Suboxone is to discourage the abuse of Suboxone specifically and not to discourage the abuse of opiates in general.
Also, I’m certainly not insulting anyone by characterizing the effects of opiates as putting you in a position to do little but “lay around.” It is not the fault of the person taking the drug that the effect is immobilizing. It is not anyone’s fault. The primary effect of an opiate painkiller is to numb pain, which it does effectively. There is no disputing that fact. The problem with opioid-based pain medications is that the residual effect is that the mind is numbed as well, reality is altered and decision-making skills are skewed. If this weren’t the case then no one would seek a treatment to opiate addiction.
The fact of the matter is that clarity cannot be obtained while addiction is in effect. The ultimate goal here is to find a way to manage chronic pain in a way that is healthy and does not stop you from attaining your goals and realizing your dreams. A Suboxone detox is a way that you can get closer to that goal, a way for you to break your physical addiction and refocus.
January 31st, 2008 at 12:29 pm
I have taken methadone everyday for 4 years and have had no problem except the relief of severe back pain. If you take methadone under the supervision of a pain doctor you are not going to have a problem. I can have a life of pain and misery or take methadone.
Somehow, people think there is some sort of “high” with methadone there is none it just takes the pain away. Also, methadone is a generic drug and is inexpensive compared to other pain killers. My methadone pain medication cost $16.00 a month. I can’t afford the cost of Suboxone or other pain medications. Methadone is a very effective and safe medication. Stop telling lies about it.
February 1st, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Congratulations on your positive experience with the drug. Know that you are in a very small percentage and also that there is a difference between taking methadone for pain and taking methadone for drug addiction. The pill form that you take may affect you differently (and therefore any observed “high”) than the liquid form taken by those undergoing drug addiction maintenance at a clinic, which absolutely produces a high, though not as intensely as, say, heroin.
And yes, methadone is cheaper than Suboxone. Suboxone is meant to be taken for a finite period to help you get off of other opiates, though some do opt to take it for maintenance. It is not prescribed for pain. It is only prescribed for drug addiction.
Methadone is cheaper than most painkillers, which is why more doctors are prescribing it for pain. However, its mechanism in the body is different and it stays active longer, even after it stops blocking pain, which means that there has been more than 1000% increase in methadone overdose deaths in the past five years. Just be careful. Respect it. For those not willing to take the risk, Suboxone is a detox option.
April 12th, 2008 at 8:47 am
Valeria, you claim that you have nothing against methadone yet every blog you post is about how everyone should switch from methadone to your center’s drug, suboxone. It’s
plainly obvious there is a financial incentive for you to say such things. Also, for you to tell Frank that his positive experience with methadone puts him in the minority is absoultely false–I would love to see the sceintific data you base that remark on! Methadone has long been the most successful method for treating opioid addiction available–THAT is the fact. And you are absolutely wrong about the liquid form being any different from the pill form (good grief!) or producing a high–that is pure BS! If someone is just starting on methadone, they MAY feel a small lift from it for a couple of weeks until they become tolerant to their dose–nothing like a heroin high, more like a sedated feeling. However, after stabilizing on their dose, they feel nothing. I know–I am on methadone, and I moderate 3 methadone support websites as well as being heavily involved in advocacy work and knowing many many methadone patients very well.
Also, you insinuate that those in methadone clinics are diverting the drugs, selling them on the street, that it is killing all these people, blah blah. Did you know that there is no accepted method for determining exactly what a “methadone related death” IS? And that if a person, for example, had a small amount of methadone, huge amounts of xanax, alcohol, other opiates and cocaine in their system at the time of death, it is usually described as a “methadone related death”? That if a person dies under ANY circumstances at ALL and has methadone in their system, it is calssified as a “methadone related death”? Were you also aware that the vast vast majority of diverted methadone and methadone deaths come NOT from the clinics at all, but from pain management? And that the number of methadone related deaths is now declining in many states, as word gets out about the senselessness of abusing it and the dangers therein? The fact is, it started being prescribed for pain more frequently after the Oxy abuse scandals broke, and kids started finding it in the medicine cabinet, possibly liking the sedated feeling they, as opiate naive users, got from it and took too much, seeking the “real” high they were used to with other opiates perhaps, and died. THAT was the cause of the rise in methadone deaths–NOT the clinics.
Suboxone is a wonderful medication–no doubt about it. However, there is NO need to “compete” with methadone, as you seem to feel, urging successful methadone patients to hurry and switch to “your” drug. Suboxone works well in general terms for those with lighter addictions to Rx painkillers–not as well for those with long term, heavier addictions. A recent study, which started heroin users on suboxone and gave them the opportunity to switch to methadone if the suboxone treatment did not control their symptoms. Close to half had to make the switch.
Though it is true that suboxone has less regulatory control, it is not necessary to make methadone treatment sound like a “life sentence” of attending the clinic every day. I go to my clinic once per month, pick up my meds, say hi to the staff, and go home. That’s it. Hardly a “sentence” of daily attendance.
In addition, just getting off opioid meds does not mean your disease has been “cured”. Addiction is a brain disease, and in some cases, enough damage has been done to the natural endorphin system that it will never repair itself, and long term treatment may be needed. The disease is not “taking drugs”, it is the dysfunctional brain chemistry.
Again–there is no need for you to be forever posting inflammatory blogs against methadone in order to promote suboxone. It is a fine medication in it’s own right, and has much to recommend it, but it is not in competition with methadone–the two meds are BOTH needed and are effective for differing segments of the addicted population. This reminds me of a mud slinging presidential campaign. Methadone patients were happy to see suboxone come along and provide another avenuse of therapy for the addicted–we do not feel the need to denigrate it and urge all suboxone patients to switch to “our” drug–why do you do this?
April 12th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
Wow, what a great post, Zenith. Thanks for your interest. I honestly have no financial incentive whatsoever for believing in Suboxone. I have firsthand experience with methadone and two of the people closest to me on the world have been on methadone maintenance for years and years. They’ll be the first to tell you that they wish I’d shut up about switching, so if my ongoing “rah-rah Suboxone” rant gets on your nerves, you’re not alone.
Of course on the SUBOXONE BLOG I would post mostly about my happy love for what Suboxone can do compared to other alternatives, but there are a few places where I have said exactly what you did: methadone is a viable option and for some, the only option that makes sense.
And the liquid IS different from the pill version. Few who take methadone for pain take 100+ milligrams in the morning and then nothing for the rest of the day; they stagger it throughout the day and the way the body metabolizes pills as opposed to liquid IS different. The method of ingestion absolutely imposes on the effect of the drug.
Everyone’s experience on methadone is different and if it’s working great for you, that’s awesome; I’m happy for you. However, for every person who benefits from it in the long-term there is someone else who doesn’t. It is to those people I am speaking. I have no interest in “converting” anyone to Suboxone, but if you wake up sick, hate going to a clinic, spend an hour or so waiting for it to kick in, then feel overwhelmingly tired when it does, your life feels possessed by the drug. It’s a rotten place to be. You have to be on methadone nine months before you can come in just once per week to get six take homes, one year to come in twice a month and more than two years to get on the monthly schedule you enjoy. That’s a looong time to wait to get to reach your level of freedom without having to petition a doctor to go on vacation.
The fact of the matter is that many who are on methadone for drug addiction (a brain disease) often do crimes to pay for their habit. Who do they see at the clinic? People they used to run with. Is everyone who goes to methadone clinics a half step ahead of catching a case? No. But an addict who isn’t on solid ground where his addiction is concerned and regularly runs into people who have an extra pill to sell, a hit of this or that, or a “business proposition” are going to have a harder time staying clean than if they have only to allow a couple pills dissolve under your tongue every couple of days. Because addiction is a brain disease, I believe it’s really important to do everything you can to improve your odds of success. They don’t call those of us who make it “1 percenters” for nothing!
April 23rd, 2008 at 3:59 am
I have been using methadone for pain for a while, so I think i have some authority on the subject. Valeria, I think you are straight up wrong about the liquid and pill form being different in effect. What you are talking about is dose related, not due to the form the drug comes in. I think liquid formulations can contain much more milligrams (100 plus in some cases), then the pill form (5 or 10 mg). Having also tried suboxone to treat my pain, I can say that for me it does not have nearly the analgesic effect that methadone has. In addition, I can also say from experience that methadone has a very low abuse potential (perhaps not as low as suboxone, however). These are the things I have learned from first-hand experience. Long story short, best for pain: methadone; best for getting off opiates: suboxone if you can tolerate the numerous side-effects, which are far better than withdrawals.
April 23rd, 2008 at 11:20 pm
Nope, definitely not wrong on this one. If you take anything–herb, vitamin, medication, what have you–it will hit you more quickly in liquid form. Your body breaks down the pill over a period of time and that delays the effects, which is why people crush them before they abuse them. Milligram for milligram, liquid hits you quicker than taking the same amount in pill form.
Suboxone has buprenorphine which is a partial agonist where methadone is a full agonist, so you are right in saying that the analgesic effects are comparatively less.
As for abuse potential, you can abuse anything if you really want to. Buprenorphine in any form is not FDA-approved for pain management, just opiate addiction treatment. It’s no good for pain, so definitely, it’s a matter of matching the treatment to the ailment.
May 3rd, 2008 at 4:48 pm
Valeria,
This is no way meant to attack you, but from what I’ve read and observed in these last posts of yours, it shows that the information you’ve provided is nothing short of just your biast opinion and personal experience. You’ve acted in these last couple replies as if you have the statistics in front of you to back all of what you claim to be true, up. Truth of the matter is, that you simply have no idea what exactly you are talking about. This was proven when Zenith “called you out” so to speak, on how those who are pleased with their Methadone Treatment are the “minority” then you made a point that you knew a measly two people on Methadone, who actually want you to step off your Suboxone SoapBox. You talk about being possessed by the drug and having to wait at the clinic for an hour while sick. Have you ever even been on Methadone? If so please let me know the clinic you attended, because I’ve never been possessed by my methadone, that must be one rare side effect, especially since I’ve been around hundreds on methadone and have yet to see that one.. You acknowledge what you call to be your “rah rah” Suboxone rant, and explain that your loved ones on Methadone wish you’d shut it. Obviously they are happy on their treatment. Let me guess they’re in the minority too? I know I’m being sarcastic but your posts are nothing short of absurd. Also, I find it to be ireesponsible of you, to act as though you are well versed on harm reduction options, when I know and you know, you’re not. Someone may think that you actually know what you’re talking about. Suboxone is NOT the wonder drug, however is effective in treating those with LIGHTER addictions for shorter periods of time, an example would be someone addicted to Vicodin for a year or two. Suboxone has shown, ( go look at the statistics) that it is NOT effective in those with heavier addictions, OR those who have been on Methadone for long periods of time. The title “REPLACEMENT” is completely off the mark. Suboxone could never replace what Methadone provides. IF suboxone were the wonder drug so many people wouldn’t run back to Methadone or transfer to Methadone from Suboxone. In fact, at my clinic the ones who have attempted to switch to suboxone, only 5% of those were succesful. That’s a fact.
Since I am for ALL harm reduction methods, it’s time we unite, there shouldn’t be the competition of the two medications. They both serve their purpose and work differently for different people. I’m happy that Suboxone has worked so well for you, but there is no need to insult Methadone Maintenance, Spew false information, or push it on to others. It’s rude and simply ignorant. It shows that you haven’t done the research, but instead, jumped right on the anti-methadone wagon. I believe quite a few on Suboxone do this, in my honest opinion it’s to make themselves feel better about being clean. It’s almost like they want to make sure that people know that Suboxone and Methadone are so different. With the idea that Suboxone= Clean & Good/ Methadone= High & Bad….It’s ridiculous. I’ve never been high off my dose, ever. It does the same thing suboxone does, but helps curb craving more efficiently. Statistics show that to be true (just so you don’t think I’m making this info up) Also, let’s not forget, that Suboxone in the recent weeks is coming under fire just like Methadone. When Suboxone first came out the pharmaceutical companies did chalk it up to be the Wonder Drug for Opiate Addiction. However, on the news lately there are stories of Suboxone being found more and more on the streets, a high interest in it among high school students for the Buzz it gives them etc…Also when you do check out some of the Suboxone websites, most on Suboxone feel duped in the sense they were made to believe that withdrawals from the Suboxone were very minor. They are angry that 4 weeks later they are still suffering. Also it the Pharmaceutical Company recently just came out with saying that even with tapering properly it can take up to 6 Weeks for withdrawals to subside. I’ve had friends on both medications and they’ve all said withdrawals were comparable, and remarked how Suboxone is NOT as easy to come off of as originally said to be. Personally, I find that it’s much easier and tempting to use while on Suboxone. For the simple reason, that in order to get high, you just skip your pill for the day. I have had many friends do just this while on it, also they all commented how their cravings were still so intense on Suboxone. On Methadone I have had not one craving. I’m not saying that everyone does have cravings on Suboxone, but just informing everyone that it has it’s flaws and is certainly not right for everyone. I think options in treatment, should be based on an individuals history, that includes length of addiction, and the heaviness of use. Valeria, I hope that you choose to do some seriously thorough research, before you mislead more people into believing that the information you provide is truthful and factual other than just you mere personal opinion.
May 3rd, 2008 at 7:45 pm
Emily, thanks for your opinion and interest. Your passion is admirable and demonstrates how passionate people are on the subject. I prefer passion to passivity any day.
I would start by pointing out that this is the SUBOXONE blog. Not the Methadone blog. Or the Harm Reduction blog. So of course my focus here is on the benefits of Suboxone. Having said that…
What I write here is based on a combination of research and experience, research including evidence-based studies in medical, psychology and scientific journals and textbooks and a Master’s degree in the physiology of addiction as well as personal experience with methadone as a client AND as a counselor. I know far more than 2 people on methadone–in fact, I know very few people who aren’t either on methadone now or have been at least once–and actually posted these particular interviews to demonstrate that methadone IS good for some people and that it IS a positive harm reduction measure and that I fully agree with it and recognize its validity. Again, I’m not anti-methadone. Not. Anti. Methadone.
But I also know people who use methadone to stay well and take other drugs to enhance it, people who shoot their dose up well beyond what they need to kick withdrawal. I know what it’s like to be sick on a crowded bus in the morning trying to get to the clinic and getting there right when it opens only to have to wait in line, meanwhile having well intentioned people offer me pills, dope, whatever to hold me. I’ve been broke and had my methadone clinic drop me 10 milligrams a day because I couldn’t pay. I’ve missed more opportunities than I can count because my body was tuned into that dose and I couldn’t change my schedule or I didn’t have the energy or I couldn’t eat or I didn’t want to miss my next dose. I’ve had doctors, co-workers, bosses, fellow students, cops treat me like a second class citizen because of my addiction history or methadone status. And I’ve relapsed more times than I can count because I didn’t make it to the clinic in time or because I metabolized my dose too quickly.
This definitely isn’t a moral thing, and I definitely don’t consider Suboxone to be a wonder drug. I don’t think any drug is a wonder drug. But I do think that doing a controlled detox is a good thing. I think being free of addiction to ANYTHING is a good thing.
Methadone, in my opinion, is not only harm reduction. It’s a maintenance and treatment. To me, harm reduction is getting clean cottons and cookers and needles at a needle exchange or marking your rig so you don’t inadvertently share needles. I consider people on methadone to be “clean and sober.” If it’s working for you, that’s great. If it’s not and you want to try something else, then Suboxone is an option and it has worked for thousands of people. That’s what I talk about here. It’s not meant to offend those who are on methadone. Choice is always a good thing, no?
May 3rd, 2008 at 10:21 pm
So, the answer to THAT problem is to see to it that methadone patients who are stable and compliant are treated the same way as those on Suboxone and are allowed to see their doctor and get a prescription fior their meds, just like anyone else, instead of faulting the medication for what is a problem of the SYSTEM of delivery. Your clinic dropping your dose because you couldn’t pay is no different than a suboxone prescribing doctor dropping a patient for non payment or a pharmacy refusing to provide prescribed suboxone to a patient that cannot pay–and right now, it is generally more expensive to take suboxone than methadone.
A controlled taper is all well and good if it works for you and if your endorphin system has not sustained permanent damage, however, remaining on eithe suboxone or methadone if one needs to is not evidence of “addiction” or a weak character–I know you did not use that last term but that is the “feeling” I get from reading some of the things you say. It is merely a medical necessity for some and not for others, and no one should be made to feel that their recovery is inferior because they take suboxone instead of being abstinent, or methadone instead of suboxone. There is a big difference, medically speaking, between dependence and addiction. People who take suboxone or methadone as prescribed and are not displaying the behaviors associated with addiction are dependent on the medication, not “addicted” to it. I saw my own mother, a woman who feared to take an aspirin, die in horrible pain from metastasized colon cancer, taking nothing more than darvocet and agonizing when she discovered that she had become physically dependent on the pills, saying “I guess I am a drug addict now” and feeling so ashamed, because that is what she understood the term to mean, though she took the pills less often than prescribed and showed NONE of the signs of addiction.
Relapsing because you did not “make it to the clinic on time” surprises me. I wonder if you were on an adequate dose? It sounds as though you were not–you say you “metabolized the drug too rapidly”. While that can happen, in most cases, people can go 24 hours without needing another dose if they are on an adequate dose to begin with. I can easily miss a day of dosing–I have had this occur twice–without it causing me any difficulty at all. This is a common topic on the support forums and very seldom does anyone suffer by missing one day’s dose. Most don’t begin to feel truly bad until the third or even fourth day. However, fear of withdrawals coming on can drive people to do something stupid before they realize that they are not five minutes away from chills, cramps and vomiting. And for the few that DO need split dosing, clinics should be pressured to provide it–another problem that could be solved by getting MMT out of the medical ghetto and into the doctor’s offices where it belongs.
Valeria, you seem like a good person, but sometimes the “tone” of your posts seems very negative towards methadone, though you claim not to feel that way. It is NOT a war or competition between the two drugs–both are needed and have value to different patient populations. We should all be fighting for the better treatment of those who need medication assisted treatment, not glorifying one over another.
May 4th, 2008 at 1:28 pm
Methadone Treatment and Suboxone, are Harm Reduction, it’s a fact. There is no debate on that. The founders of them recognize them as harm reduction methods. It’s not meant to be considered a “bad” thing. It is what it is. I do consider myself clean even on MMT, but I realize that in order to function normally I depend on Methadone which is a narcotic, however doesn’t provide a high that it might for others that are opiate Naive. Suboxone has bupe in it, which is also a painkiller, this is Harm Reduction. Anyways, I completely understand that this is a Suboxone blog, and as I’ve said I’m all for Suboxone. But you say you’re not Anti Methadone, but look at the title of this, Good Replacement for Methadone? And then you say those who are happy on Methadone are the small percentage? It’s obvious that you are insinuating that Methadone is not as good as Suboxone and that most don’t like it. That is what I’m replying too. By your reply to me, it’s was quite evident that you dogded most of what I said, by bringing up in my personal opinion, the petty subject, over me calling these types of addiction treatment harm reduction,(which they are) And also, trying to point out that this is a Suboxone blog. Well Duh, that’s fine, but keep in mind the title of this Blog, has “Methadone” right in it. So I feel as though this is my place to respond to the claims you’ve made. I feel that what you’ve written is misleading and untrue. There’s a difference between being for Suboxone, and for being Anti-Methadone, which you claim you aren’t but most would agree that even the idea of saying Suboxone is a “good replacement” shows you feel Suboxone to be Superior. As I’ve said before, a well-educated (as far as Suboxone and Methadone research goes) person would know that Suboxone could never replace Methadone. The two medications are for TWO DIFFERENT types of opiate addicts.
Also, you say you were sick on the way to your clinic? Obviously you weren’t on an appropriate effective dose, I’m never sick in the mornings and people on an effective dose are NEVER sick in the mornings. I also feel it is less tempting to use illegal substances when you know you have to check in more frequently, at the Methadone Clinic. With Suboxone all you do is get your script and are able to do whatever you want. It’s true that you must report to the clinic in the begining but for me that was a good thing it kept me clean, due to randome screenings. Now, I have my takehomes, and because I had to report to the clinic in the begining everyday, I broke that vicious cycle of addiction, and the drug lifestyle. Whereas on Suboxone there is no one guiding you. I mean, yes any addict would love to just pick up their pills, but when you think about it, an addicts thinking and choices aren’t always a good ones. Sometimes having to report to the clinic in the mornings gives you that motivation to stay clean and earn your takehomes. Same type of system if you went to a drug rehab, you earn phases, etc….There are pro’s and cons to everything. Personally, Suboxone would’ve never worked for me. It would have been to easy in the begining to sell my pills and go buy some heroin. The clinic system can sometimes be a blessing in disguise. That is, if your serious about getting clean. Good Luck to You, as I’ve said before, I’m happy you’ve managed to stay clean and your medication is right for you. Just as my medication is right for me. Bottom line is Suboxone is not for everyone and Methadone isn’t right for everyone. One could never replace another, it’s a ludicris thought, idea, whatever.
May 4th, 2008 at 8:28 pm
I think we’re talking about two different things here: maintenance and detox. When I’m writing these posts and talking about Suboxone, I’m speaking to the person who has a daily opiate addiction of any kind and wants to detox off of their drug of choice. Meditox offers detox, not maintenance. So if you don’t want to be on your opiate medication any longer–no matter which opiate it is, no matter what it is prescribed for–for whatever reason then Suboxone is a way to do that. Period. If you don’t want to detox off of your medication–no matter which medication that is or what it is prescribed for–nobody here thinks any less of you for it, certainly not me. And I definitely would never describe someone on methadone as having a “weak character.” I made a point of characterizing it as beyond harm reduction because it’s a huge step that is beyond most harm reduction measures. It’s changing your life, not just protecting yourself from contracting HIV and Hep C (though it does that, too). It wasn’t meant to be argumentative. I was commending you and all those who stay on methadone to stay clean.
Nobody’s trying to talk you into detoxing if it’s not right for you. Nobody’s judging anyone for their choices. Nobody’s saying that your medication is bad or inferior in any way or that you are bad or inferior for taking it. If you want to detox, Suboxone is an option. That’s it and that’s all.
May 4th, 2008 at 11:29 pm
But Valeria, I am not the first one to notice this attitude with you towards methadone. You blog about methadone more than any other drug except Oxycontin, and many of the posts have what I would refer to as “judgmental titles”, I.E. “Interview with a Methadone ADDICT” (as opposed to a methadone patient). If you had been interviewing a suboxone patient would you have titled it “Interview with a suboxone addict”? And in most of these interviews, you try to paint a bleak picture of life on MMT–often even though the subjects of the interview deny it–and always wrap it up with “Have you thought of getting on suboxone or of switching to suboxone”, always seeming to imply that this would be the better choice for the patient even if they are doing well.
I think you might want to look within and see if possibly you have more of an anti methadone bias than you may realize.
May 4th, 2008 at 11:52 pm
Here are more such comments in previous blogs:
“If you or someone you love is addicted to methadone or another prescription opiate medication, consider taking matters into your own hands and breaking that addiction with a medical detoxification like Suboxone detox and treatment. Rather than entering into a drug addiction rehab facility that requires time and money that you may not have, a Suboxone treatment can be obtained from a doctor as long as he or she is certified to dispense (or prescribe) buprenorphine. Meditox has doctors available to you specifically for this purpose. Call for more information today.”
“Rather than continue the cycle of methadone dosing, pain, withdrawal and possible overdose, it makes more sense to break your addiction to methadone completely. By switching to Suboxone, you can successfully detox off of other opiate drugs and slowly and safely break your opiate addiction completely before it gets the better of you.”
“It seems to me that with such a far reaching (and expensive) goal the far more cost-effective and efficient route would be to implement Suboxone treatment centers instead of methadone clinics in Vietnam. With longer blocking action thanks to the naloxone in the mixture, Suboxone is far more effective than methadone for those who are addicted to street drugs.” (Where you get your stats for that last remark I would be very interested to hear. For one thing, people on adequate doses of methadone are blocked from feeling the effects of opiates for days, not hours.)
“What’s unbelievable is that anyone on 40 milligrams of methadone or less would opt to continue to choose that form of detox when buprenorphine is available.”
“Methadone is more highly restricted by the federal government than buprenorphine, requiring all who take it to come into their prescribing clinic or drug treatment facility every day to get their dose. Within 24 hours, the effects of methadone begin to wear off and skipping a day is not an option.” (this is misleading and blatantly false. You say ALL who take it must come in daily, when surely you are aware of takehome doses. I go to the clinic once per month, just as a bupe patient does. Also, most people on an adequate dose can easily miss a day of dosing without experiencing any major or moderate problems at all. And guest dosing at other clinics is becoming a relic of the past, as the newer Federal regs allow for takehome exemptions for trips, etc. even if the patient has not “earned” them yet).
“Methadone, on the other hand, gives a little rush when it first hits, which disappears pretty quickly, leaving you dog-tired and dragging until the next day when you start to feeling the stabbing, cramping pains of withdrawal or “dope sickness.” (again, untrue unless the dose is wrong. I most assuredly do not feel this way, nor do most of the other MMT patients I know–and as a patient advocate who moderates three boards, I know quite a few).
and Finally:
“There is definitely a place for methadone maintenance. For many, it’s the only way to handle their drug addiction and stay off the streets. For others, it provides the time they need to detox off of an addiction to a really high dose of heroin, morphine, Vicodin, OxyContin and other opiates. However, for those who are ready to get serious and get over it, Subutex or Suboxone pills are the way to go.” (implying that those who remain on methadone are not ready to “get serious” and get over it.)
You are certainly entitled to your opinion–but to say that you are not dogging MMT on this forum is just not accurate. There is much condescension and many misleading statements regarding MMT and almost every methadone post is negative.
May 5th, 2008 at 11:12 am
Zenith, methadone has a much shorter half-life than Suboxone which is why it is necessary to take it daily rather than every few days. It is chemistry, not an opinion. You do have to earn take-homes and getting a month’s worth, as you do, can take up to a year and if you “mess up” by missing a group, for example, you “lose” those take-homes and go back to square one. And I’ve been through the process of “applying for take homes” for trips, watched others get denied their application and told that they would be dropped if they missed more than three days in a row. Even if you get “approved,” you have to apply in advance. I’ve known some clinics to require proof that travel reservations have been made, so forget spontaneous travel. It is not a thing of the past here, not by a long shot. And it is a concession you make to remain on the drug if you are being treated for opiate addiction.
We can argue for days about the virtues of methadone. I’ve seen it work for many people. I’ve seen it work for people for 20+ years. It has saved lives and I don’t wish it gone or think ill of any one who is on it for however long they choose to be on it.
However, I and many people I know don’t and didn’t handle the regulations very well. I don’t deal well with authority. I don’t like it that I have to consider the rules of clinic before I make plans. I don’t like being dependent on anything if I don’t have to be, physically, mentally or emotionally. Because you seem to infer from my statements that I am implying that the opposite of my experience is true for those on methadone, I’m not saying that you enjoy subjugation or are submissive in any way. I’m saying that if you have experienced what I’m talking about and don’t want to anymore, there is a way out without kicking cold turkey or returning to street drugs.
My tone is not meant to convey condescension but encouragement to those who are ready to stop taking medication that they don’t want to be on. My honest intention is to help those who are currently on methadone and not happy with it, those who are looking for something else. I appreciate that you are not that person and have no desire to change you or your opinions or choices, nor anyone who has chosen a path similar to yours. I wish you all the best.
May 6th, 2008 at 11:51 am
America in now in a depression and the cost of medication is a big issue. I can’t afford $500 to $600 dollars a month for pain medication. If I paid that much for pain medication I would not eat or have a place to sleep. Suboxone is Very expensive and not a good pain reliever while Methadone is inexpensive and an outstanding pain reliever. My prescription costs me $16.00 a month for 90 5mg methadone pills. I don’t know what 90 Suboxone pills would cost but it would be much more expensive than $16.00 dollars.
As America ages and more and more people require pain management, there will be more Methadone use. Not everyone who takes Methadone is an idiot. Most of the people I know who take it are older people who have some severe injury or disease. Also, Methadone has No affect on your liver or kidneys a very important aspect for some people. Both medications have their place and purpose. I would say that Methadone is under used but will be used more and more as money for medications becomes an issue.
May 8th, 2008 at 4:26 pm
Valeria,
Why don’t you admit you Anti-Methadone, your twisting it by saying your just “Pro Suboxone” But By Zenith’s Examples of your posts, we all obviously know you are not for methadone. And you lie, Methadone leaves you dog tired? Who are you to spew any of this crap about Methadone, oh and my favorite is “If you are serious and want to get over it, Suboxone is the good option” Excuse me, but I’m damn serious about my recovery and I’m on Methadone. Getting on Suboxone doesn’t make any one more “Serious” about getting clean.
Also, I don’t get the quick rush, and I’m sure as hell not “Cramping up” on the way to the clinic. You are so ridiculous, why don’t you just stick to what you know? Which obviously does NOT involve anything to do with Methadone. I’m tired of you saying “This is a Suboxone Blog” and “I’m Just encouraging those that are on Medication they don’t want to be on” You obviously think Suboxone is best for everybody because it works for you. But I have news for you sweetie, lots of people despise Suboxone and the side effects. Lots of people with heavy addictions fail on Suboxone. It’s important when you have a forum like this, to speak the truth, as people will rely on this for valid information. As your posts show, you are extremely misleading and irresponsible. Not to mention ignorant. Hopefully people won’t read what you have to say and take it for face value and do their OWN research and get the RIGHT information.
LASTLY, you say we are talking about two different things as far as Suboxone and Methadone goes, since I’m talking about maintenance, and you are talking about detoxing on Suboxone, then why was the title “Suboxone good replacement for Methadone” If we are talking about “TWO” different things then why are you trying to compare them in the first place. Unfortunately, you make absolutely no sense what so ever. This is proved as you back pedal on everything you say. It’s kind of amusing as I’m not sure if you take me for some one of less intelligence, that is going to read your blurb and take you as the “professional” you try to come off as, but I know better, as I’ve done my research quite thoroughly and have seen enough by being on Methadone and seeing others on Methadone, that more than half the junk you write about is false. Also, I’ve seen many on Suboxone fail miserably. I’ve also seen some with small habits succeed on it. Zenith also brings up a great point, you really seemed obsessed with Methadone. Your hate for it is apparent, but you really feel the need to talk about it way way too much. This is my honest opinion, but in a way I sense some type of insecurity about being in a harm reduction type program, which was shown when you jumped up to defend that it was not “harm reduction” which it’s fine if you want to deny it as such but since it IS a harm reduction program, it’s just you in denial, and justifying Suboxone any way you can. I sense that you feel guilty that you take Suboxone, maybe your loved ones make you feel this way, who knows? So you automatically chalk it up to be this wonder drug and by comparing to the BIG BAD METHADONE. You make everyone think that “Wow, Suboxone is nothing like methadone, and by being on Suboxone you are somehow “Cleaner” than if your were on Methadone” Which is untrue. It’s okay to be on either Medications Valeria. You need to accept the suboxone is the same type of treatment as Methadone. Both come with Pro’s and Con’s. So this is my take on you, who knows maybe you have family members that look down on you and you use this platform to build yourself up and make your decisions look like the “Right” ones.
Just remember to everyone who reads this forum, Methadone saves tons of Lives, it has saved mine, and if you are on Suboxone and it isn’t working transferring to Methadone doesn’t make you a failure and it sure as hell doesn’t give you the side effects Valeria writes about, she has no idea what she is talking about, so please do your own research, in fact a great place to gather information, about Methadone is WespeakMethadone.com the forums there are not only for Methadone but harm reduction as a whole. There are some there on Suboxone even, no one gives biast views,and calls them FACTS, just the truth. There is never any bashing of Methadone or Suboxone, and Suboxone is NOT being held on this false pedestal that Valeria Paints. In fact, Valeria, I haven’t heard you ONCE mention the Side Effects or Issues that go on with Suboxone, why is that? You have NO problem going on and on about Methadones and even worse, making side effects up and over exaggerating them. But nothing you’ve written is about the problems those face on Suboxone. It’s just cupcakes and rainbows isn’t it? It shows that you are very young minded and misinformed, you yourself need some guidance before guiding others. Don’t you think?
May 8th, 2008 at 10:47 pm
Wow, Emily, you sound really upset about this. I certainly didn’t mean to offend you, and if I gave you the impression that I was belittling you or your recovery, I apologize. My experience has clearly been very different from yours, and I respect your right to disagree, however, I assure you that my statements here are grounded in research and personal experience. Since February, the only posts on methadone have been the interviews, so due attention has been and will continue to be paid to a variety of other drugs and aspects of opiate addiction. Again, thank you so much for your continued interest and lively debate. I wish you the best in your recovery.
May 8th, 2008 at 11:23 pm
It’s not about being upset Valeria, I’m passionate. I’m passionate about the truth. I’m passionate of wiping away this negative stigma that has been attached to Methadone too long. And it’s nothing short of disheartening, when you read another Opoid treatment option contributing to myths and stigma. Now I understand, that you have had your own experience with Methadone, and that’s fine. I don’t have a problem with you voicing Your negative experience, I have a problem with you turning that into a fact about Methadone. An example of this would be something I’ve already mentioned, but when you say those with positive experiences on Methadone are the minority. That isn’t a fact, so I’m not quite sure why you would say that, other than to deter those from considering methadone as an option. Maybe this is all for some sort of Monetary gain from Meditox for you, and you feel the need to beat out your competition so to speak. I’m not quite sure. Anyways Valeria, I wish YOU the best of luck with your recovery and your treatment. I hope you are able to feel more comfortable with Suboxone as being Harm reduction and accept that it’s okay to be on Methadone OR Suboxone, if needed. As we both know, they are two different Medications, satisfying the same purpose, which is saving lives. Good Luck with Everything Valeria.
May 9th, 2008 at 7:51 am
But by saying that if you are ready to “get serious and get over it” then suboxone is the way to go…..do you not see that this implies that those who may need to remain on MMT are NOT ready to get serious” about recovery? And that someone who truly NEEDS to be on MMT might read this and feel ashamed that they must not be ready to “get serious” about their recovery, etc? You don’t say “for those who are unhappy with their methadone treatment”……you say “If you are ready to get SERIOUS….” and THAT is derrogatory towards those who choose to remain on MMT.
Yes, it is true that on methadone you have to work up to takehomes–but for many people with serious, long term addictions, that is necessary to avoid abusing the medication before you are stabilized on it. People with short term, light addictions and good support systems at home may not require this, and for them suboxone is a good option.But implying that methadone patients are “submissive” and enjoy authority or something is just silly. There are deiffering severities of addiction with differing treatment needs, and methadone would be for severe levels of addiction–and these folks may require a higher level of care at first.
However, I can tell you that during my first three months of treatment, when the only takehomes I had were on sundays when the clinic was closed, I was not worried about business trips or pleasure excursions–I had no job and had used up all my money on drugs and was in no position to travel. By the time I was in such a position again, I had takehome doses and could and did travel where and when I wanted–it has never been an issue for me at all. When people have to travel on short notice, most folks cannot just pick up and take off–all kinds of arrangements must be made–child care, time off from work, someone to cover your other obligations, etc. Most folks who have problems with this are those who have not put down the drugs and thus have not earned takehome doses–unless they are in very early treatment–and as I said, exceptions can be granted for emergency travel even for these folks so there is no longer a need for guest dosing.
What bothers me is that it is not necessary to make misleading comments. Saying “requiring ALL WHO TAKE IT to come into the clinic daily to get their dose” IS misleading! within 9-12 months of beginning treatment, one need go in only weekly, and within 1 1/2 years, twice per month–and in many states, monthly takehomes may be gained after 2 years. Yes, suboxone allows a greater degree of freedom at first–no one is arguing that this is not true–but there is NO NEED to imply that methadone requires each and every patient to come to the clinic every day in order to make suboxone look good–THAT is what I am saying. And saying that methadone WILL leave you “dog tired and dragging” and that by the time you dose again you WILL be “feeling the stabbing, cramping pains of withdrawal” is untrue. Perhaps that WAS your experience. I had a very bad experience with buprenorphine myself, but I do not tell everyone else that it “WILL” make them feel so anxious they want to tear their hair out, that it won’t help their cravings one bit, or that they will suffer from depression on it, because it isn’t true–that was simply MY experience and the drug works VERY well for many people. I think that perhaps your dose was not correct–no one should be in withdrawals every morning before dosing, and if you were you may have been a fast metabolizer. That would explain both your exhausted feeling soon after dosing and your early withdrawals. A split dose may have helped you. But please do not assume that your feelings are everyone’s feelings, or your experience everyone’s experience.
Valeria, this may feel like an attack to you and if so I apologize. I just really wish that those who support suboxone treatment could see it as we do–as a very vakued medication that is much needed and works well for a significant proportion of addicts–NOT as a competitor of methadone. There is just no need to put methadone down to promote suboxone–and the only reason I have persued this with you is because I do truly feel that you may be more open minded than some and may actually try to hear what I and others here are saying. If I felt you were totally closed minded I would have left long ago.
May 9th, 2008 at 11:18 am
I do hear what you’re saying, Zenith. And again, I thank you for pointing out my inconsistencies. I will take care in the future to clarify that my experiences do not apply across the board. When writing this, I was thinking of Suboxone as a short-term detox measure and not as a long-term maintenance measure like MMT; I should have been more clear. Any medication that helps us stay clean is only a positive thing, be it maintenance or detox. Thanks again for taking the time to share your experience. I do appreciate your comments.
May 9th, 2008 at 11:30 am
Thanks for understanding, Valeria. Sub is a great medication–I wish it HAD worked for me! But it is NOT a substitute for methadone–it is simply another wonderful treatment option that allows many people for whom straight-to-abstinence treatment did not work and methadone was too much for, to access treatment that works for them without such an interruption in their lives. I think that there is really a different “target audience” if you will, for methadone and suboxone, but there are cases in which people who are now on methadone could make the switch to sub, and I can understand you suggesting it to people. I often do so myself. If you could just maybe avoid the implication that methadone is somehow inferior, that is what I am hoping for. Suboxone “sells” on it’s own merits–it doesn’t need to fight a “mudslinging” campaign (guess the upcoming elections are getting to me, lol!).
Thanks,
Zenith
May 9th, 2008 at 9:46 pm
Buprenorphine is very hard on your liver and kidneys. The long term use of Buprenorphine is just beginning in time many side effects maybe noted. It’s too expensive for most people to use anyway. If you can’t afford it its worthless to you. The price of medications in America is going to be a real issue as time passes.
You will see more and more use of methadone as it’s inexpensive and has a long safety record. My pain doctor says it’s the best drug for severe pain there is. Methadone is here to stay and people who take it for pain following a pain doctor’s orders won’t have a problem. Methadone is a serious drug for serious pain. There are always a few people who will take something like methadone and then drink a quart of gin and turn up dead. Stupidity killed them not methadone. In most of these cases stupidity killed the person not methadone.
May 12th, 2008 at 1:24 am
Valeria
I stumbled upon the Meditox website and I must say I am astonished at some of your statements and responses. The stigma against methadone is perpetuated by the media, politicians and even fellow healthcare providers who should know better. Buprenorphine is a great medication in treating opioid dependency, just as methadone is. Each medication has its advantages and strengths. Insinuating individuals who are on methadone for their treatment of opioid dependency should switch medications to the ‘more effective buprenorphine’ is innacurate and troublesome. Addiction is a chronic brain disease, subject to relapses. Methadone and buprenorphine are not cures, they are merely tools used in assisting people in their recovery process. Yet you suggest that it is methadone that truly becomes the opiate dependent individual’s vice (a very unfortunate and inaccurate suggestion). It is the nature of opioid dependency itself (and its consequential affect on the brain and endorphin system) that makes long-term or indefinite agonist or partial agonist treatment the most effective strategy. Whether using bup or methadone, outcomes are better on maintenance treatment. The nature of the disease doesn’t change with the medication- opiate addiction is opiate addiction.
That’s why your page’s opening statement is disturbing:
‘Rather than continue the cycle of methadone dosing, pain, withdrawal and possible overdose, it makes more sense to break your addiction to methadone completely. By switching to Suboxone, you can successfully detox off of other opiate drugs and slowly and safely break your opiate addiction completely before it gets the better of you.’
This introductory statement gives the message that Suboxone is somehow a cure and that opiate addiction is not a chronic disease. The fact of the matter is approximately 75% of individuals who cease agonist or partial agonist medication, relapse to illicit opiate use within 6-12 months. Therefore, it’s irresponsible as a treatment provider (such as yourself) to give the message that ’success’ can only be achieved when an individual no longer has to take medication. Painting this picture will set many people up for failure- prompting people who may not be ‘ready’ to taper off treatment to exit medication-assisted care. And when relapse occurs, it often results in people internalizing their perceived failure and reinforcing the misconception that addiction is somehow a character flaw. Success should be viewed by what gains indiviuals make while ON maintenance treatment and not necessarily OFF of treatment. We do not use the same criteria of evaluating hypertension and diabetes- other chronic diseases. Why should bup/methadone be any different. So we’d all be better served by focusing on reinforcing the behavioral changes people attain while on treatment (both methadone and burpenorphine) rather then simply promoting suboxone as a cure. But then again, as I’m sure you and your company are well aware, promoting short-term detoxes is a sure-fire way to ensure repeat business.
May 12th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Thanks for your input, Chad. There has been long discussion and debate on this topic as you can see and I value your comments. Short-term detox is just one option, a good idea for some people while long-term maintenance works signficantly better for others. I certainly did not mean to imply that detox in any form is better than maintenance if maintenance is what you need. This post was for people who are dissatisfied with methadone–whether they take it for pain management or drug addiction–for whatever reason and are looking for a way off that doesn’t mean returning to street drugs. I apologize for the miscommunication. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.
May 12th, 2008 at 4:44 pm
Valeria,
You keep repeating that this is only for people who are dissatisfied with their methadone treatment, what does that have to do with you blatant methadone bashing. I understand some are unsatisfied with their methadone and if I were I’d probably look into other options as well. I’m all for whatever works, I’ve said it a million times before. What I don’t understand is why you have to make statements, about Methadone being unsafe and toxic levels, and also withdrawals from Methadone, and how excruciating they are etc..It’s quite obvious that you get some sort of incentive, as you are using scare tactics, to get others that are thinking about Methadone to go to Suboxone. You could easily help others who were unsatisfied with Methadone, in a way without bashing it the way you do, there is no “Misunderstanding” it is what it is. Anyways I just thought I’d post on how excruciating Suboxone withdrawals can also be, here are some stories I’ve found at steadyhealth.com I will ensure you they are real. and you can find them at the site. I copied and pasted these.
**********FIRST STORY************
I was taking Vicodin for two years for my hands and got hookedso I stopped. So, I went on Suboxone 10 mg and was on that for a year. my last day of Suboxone I was dying, diarrhea, vomiting, chills, restless legs, back pain, no energy, so I took myself to a detox hospital for four days and then suffered the rest at home. I did not start feeling better for 27 days, what a hell I was in.
**********ANOTHER STORY******************************
My doctor had me on Suboxone for 2 years and tried to take me off like your doctor did. I was originally on 12 mils and over a period of 3 weeks I tapered down to 2 mils due to having neck problems that require surgery. Then about 2 wks ago I was told by my doctor it was okay to stop taking Suboxone. I was okay for about one day and then had these horrible panic attacks. I felt pain all over my body and felt like there were spiders crawling under my skin on my legs. It was horrible. About 4 days into my detox I had a friend come and basically live with me because I couldn’t function anymore. I had panic attacks at least 2 times a day and I mean these were the kind where you break out sweating and shaking. I called my doctor and went to see him and left in tears because he told me that it was all in my head and I would just have to deal with the withdrawls. I found out through researching the web that I should have never stopped taking Suboxone at the dose. I finally gave up and was told by my doctor to go back on Suboxone. Basically to take a quarter of a 2 mil pill. I feel better but I have to get off this drug. I am now going to go inpatient to a facility to do this.
****************Third Story***************
I have been on suboxone for 9 months and told my doctor i’m ready to come off . he rapidly weaned me off within 1 WEEK !!!!! i took ONLY 8 MG A DAY . it’s been 7 days and i NEVER FELT THIS BAD IN MY INTIOR LIFE . I FEEL SO DEPRESSED , ANXIETY RIDDEN TO THE POINT I GO INTO PANIC ATTACKS . I CAN’T GET OUT OF BED / OR GO TO WORK . SUPPOSEDLY THIS IS UN HEARD OF “PER MY DOCTOR ” . that is such BS BECAUSE ALL THE INPUT I’M READING I COULD BE LIKE THIS FOR ANOTHER 3 WEEKS . IT’S SO BAD THAT I BEGGED TO GO BACK ON THE SHIT UNTIL A LATER DATE . I WILL LOSE MY JOB IF THIS CONTINUES. MY THEORY IS I’M LITERALLY PUTTING MYSELF INTO ANOTHER DETOX ONCE MY DOCTORB TAKES ME OFF . I WILL NEVER DO THIS AT HOME AGAIN . CLONODINE PATCH, DOXIPIN ( FOR SLEEP ) OR NOT . I NEVER FELT THIS BAD KICKING OXYCOTIN PILLS. I’M A NORMAL SMART GIRL WITH A GREAT JOB WHICH THE SUBOXONE HAS ROBBED ME OFF . I CANT TAKE IT ANYMORE . WHY THEY EVEN PUT US ON THIS CRAP IN THE FIRST PLACE IS BEYOND ME . WE HAVE ENOUGH PROBLEMS NEVER MIND KICKING ANOTHER DRUG. IT’S FUNNY TOO WHEN I CALLED THE DOCTOR WITH ALL THESE SYSTEMS HE TRIED SAYING THAT “”"”I HAVE PYCHIATRIC ISSUES AND IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SUBOXONE “” THAT IS CRAP I WAS FINE BEFORE I WENT ON THIS . NOW I HAVE ALL THESE PROBLEMS TRYING TO KICK IT . HE IS JUST TRYING TO PUSH ME OFF SO HE DOESN’T HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT . I KNOW MYSELF BETTER THEN ANYBODY ELSE I NEVER EVER FELT THIS BAD EVER . NEVER MIND I’M ON MY 7TH DAY AND I ALREADY LOST 4 LBS . I CANT EAT DRINK NOTHING . THIS IT LUTERCRIS. ALL I CAN SAY IS “THIS SHALL PASS ”
***********************************************************
There are plenty more stories are steadyhealth.com on withdrawals from suboxone, and also of Methadone. I am not saying that Methadone withdrawals are a walk in the park, but I am saying that Suboxone has it’s Cons and downfalls as well. Withddrawing is not so easy.
May 12th, 2008 at 11:44 pm
Hi again, Emily. You’re right that there are definite issues with every form of opiate withdrawal treatment, including Suboxone. Thanks for posting some of those stories here. I appreciate hearing about people’s personal experiences because ultimately, statistics and studies only go so far. Different people react differently to different drugs, so it’s extraordinarily important to listen when people share their stories. Thanks again, Emily.
June 3rd, 2008 at 5:15 pm
I took vicodin 6 a day for several years for back, neck, hip, knee ankle and shoulder problems stemming from a serious auto/ped accident. Then went through pain program at famous San Francisco facility, which at that juncture I was put on OXYCONTIN. Then I saw an addiction specialist and was subsequently given METHADONE. First of all, Oxycontin is by far more addictive with worse side-affects than Methadone. At first I didn’t want to change but afterwards was glad because it was not only less expensive, it also is a completely different “horse” so to speak. The half life is greater than all the others and the withdrawl is much less. It doesn’t wreck your liver like some painkillers do!
Thus, unless you have personally experienced this med, don’t judge without doing some background, and remember not all pharmacists have the “correct info.” I’ve learned this personally. Like one other commentator remarked, you can suffer or not.